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Heat with headers

5K views 33 replies 18 participants last post by  Knightranger 
#1 ·
I am finding the long drives in hot conditions is causing havoc with brake and clutch. After 3 hours on the road at speed today, I exited the freeway and clutch pedal fell to floor. Lifted it and pumped and it returned to squishy but operable behaviour. We took a lunch break, topped up the reservoir and all feels fine for now. Breaks get soft and fade after getting hot. Regular pumping helps. I am betting the headers are cooking the fluid in the clutch and brake lines. So heat shielding or my forced return to the stock heat shielded manifolds and cats may be in order.

Still Grinning though.
 
#2 ·
#3 · (Edited)
If you can, take the time to pick up Motul RBF 660 high temp brake fluid or similar high temp fluid. It can be found at motorcycle shops (usually crotch rocket cycle shops ). Pick up a dollar store turkey baster and suck out the old fluid from the reservoir. Be very careful not to let any drip on the paint.
Fill reservoir. After another 600 miles or so, suck it out again. Eventually it will get cleaner and the pedal feel will be better.

This can be done on the brake master also.
(Jim, by proxy. Still locked out)
 
#4 ·
You may be going back to stock anyway when you get it licensed due to CA regs on modified exhaust

If you can, take the time to pick up Motul RBF 660 high temp brake fluid or similar high temp fluid. It can be found at motorcycle shops (usually crotch rocket cycle shops ). Pick up a dollar store turkey baster and suck out the old fluid from the reservoir. Be very careful not to let any drip on the paint.
Fill reservoir. After another 600 miles or so, suck it out again. Eventually it will get cleaner and the pedal feel will be better.

This can be done on the brake master also.
(Jim, by proxy. Still locked out)
Same fluid?
 
#9 · (Edited)
Wait...you have Annie's old truck, right?

Hmmm...she wasn't known as the clutchkiller for nothing!!! :)

I seem to remember she ALWAYS had clutch issues with that truck...

I know the clutch was swapped multiple times and that she kept the fluid changed with the proper stuff.

BUT...Motul absorbs moisture QUICKLY (as does all Dot 4, moreso than Dot 3), especially down in the Miami area. I'm in Louisiana and I pull a travel trailer with my truck. I have NEVER had clutch issues even pulling up slow mountain grades in 100 degree heat since switching to Motul. Prior to that, I used GM's Super Dot 4 which also worked well. Avoid Wagner's supposed Super Dot 4 as it boiled immediately and left me without my clutch in downtown St. Louis. Not a good place to be broke down in a fancy truck pulling a fancy Airstream and being a tourist. Again, the Wagner fluid is complete sh*t. Also, regular Dot 3 does not work well in these trucks. Stick with the Motul. It's your best bet.

Anyhoo...

The key is flushing the fluid out OFTEN when your truck is generating heat for whatever reason (I don't have headers but I REALLY give my truck a workout pulling a big load). I flush the system before every major trip and again before I head back home. So, it's almost always pretty fresh. When I flush out the old fluid, I suck it out first with a 60cc syringe and fill the reservoir with new fluid. I then pump the pedal about a hundred times and siphon out the old fluid completely. I repeat this three times in a row, sometimes four. So, the fluid's fresh, and it NEVER boils.

I also make a point on long trips to open the hood and let some of the trapped heat out whenever I stop to get gas. I also have Mike's aux fan set to come on at the lowest temperature setting on long trips; that way, when stopped, it stays on and helps circulate a little air in the engine compartment.

Hope this helps!
 
#10 ·
I topped up the clutch master cylinder and have gone to dropping off the cruise control and pumping the clutch and brake a few times to move the fluid about and cycle what is close to the headers. That has cleared the clutch issue but the brakes are getting worse.

I am getting a second opinion from a trusted cousin who was a mechanic and tow truck driver in the morning. I am hoping for fluid breakdown from heat rather than master cylinder fail. I will probably do a bit of turkey baster drain and replace with the container of Motul I have with me to get stable brake response for the trip. Then plan a full fluids change when I get home. If we can get it jacked up and do some heat shielding we will do that as well.

Also, I have never had the fan running when the car is not. So I may need to do some diagnostics on that and / or replace the fan.

The trip continues. Did Tampa to New Orleans then turned north yesterday. Left Hammond LA this morning with the top down. Spent a few hours with family in Dardanelle AR this afternoon. Spending the night in Sallisaw OK.
 
#11 ·
It is highly probable that Annie installed Mike's auxillary fan in your truck. Alot of us have it and for most of us old timers here it was one of the first mods any of us did. It is a little pusher fan mounted in front of the radiator. It has a separate thermostat control on the passenger's fender wall and you can set it to come on wherever you wish; it WILL stay on when the truck is off until the temperature drops below whatever the thermostat control is set at.

Regarding the brakes...I've had mine feel spongy at times. They are simple to bleed yourself with a helper but they take time. If that fluid is old (I wouldn't assume it is but it could be) it could very easily be compromised due to the moisture it no doubt picked up being down here in the south.

If you can't bleed the brakes yourself, it would be wise to go to any Chevy dealer and have them power bled. It only costs around $100 and they will get ALL the old fluid out and put fresh in...but it will be most probably be Dot 3, which coincidentally is FINE for these trucks. Dot 4 and Super Dot 4 ARE better, but fresh Dot 3 will be better than what you have now. I requested GM's Super Dot 4 at my dealer once years ago and they had no problem using it...and charging me accordingly.

Have you contacted Annie? She should be able to let you know what's in the truck and when it was last serviced regarding the brakes and clutch.

Hope this helps!
Jeff
 
#12 ·
Well I found my brake problem. While having daughter pump the brake as we did a little baster action I noticed a spot near the drivers wheel. Looks like a leak from the caliper. Apparently that is what caused the paint on the inside of the rim to blister.

Local parts store had a caliper for $54. Now to change it, bleed the brakes, return the core and get back on the road.
 

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#14 ·
Whew, you are really having a great adventure.
Please keep us posted as I, for one, am living vicariously through your trip.
 
#18 ·
Okay today was a bit of a wash with repairs issues and finding new challenges. Fortunately we had a family yard and shop of tools to work with.

1. Brake fluid should not look like coffee.
2. So that was the vibration that started.
3. Well that's a project
 

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#21 ·
There were times yesterday when I was cursing her but once we understood each other and addressed the issues, things smoothed right out. She has definitely made up for it quite a bit today. We are not quite out of Kansas yet but are making good time.

There was a bump and seam on one of the OK highways that was bad and probably would have wiped out that bad tire if we had not found and replaced it.

Damn she is beautiful when happy and purring along. She just makes the miles melt by.
 
#22 ·
Well crap! :banghead Marco Muffler called and they cannot get the passenger side header out without lifting the engine or :eek cutting up the header! :eek :surprise: I asked them to lift the engine and I will hope for the best.

I am hoping someone on here will want a set of Kooks custom long tube headers and custom 3" high flow cats for their Not in CA car. I will make them a good deal on them so I can recover some of this cost. :(
 
#24 ·
From '72, when I worked for Chrysler & Buick, we used to say.... "just take it IN, and Let it Fail". They'll (smog station) will tell you what to "fix" to pass and come back for a re-test. After that, I always just took mine in and waited to fix anything instead of trying to 2nd guess the smog machine. (I never had anything newer than 10yrs old, either).
 
#26 ·
DC: That header will come out without taking bolts off motor mounts...I've done it several times. It is easy if on a lift, much more difficult on jack stands. It takes a little dropping and twisting but it can be done. After you've done it a few times it gets easier. I do understand why they say that they can't get it out because it is difficult. Taking the starter off (2 bolts) makes it easier. I have a power disconnect in my engine compartment so I shut that off and take the starter loose, zip tie to the frame and remove the header. Otherwise I would disconnect battery so that line to the starter does not contact any metal on the frame.
 
#27 ·
6.0 is more difficult than the 5.3, and in my case required lifting the engine after removing the nut to allow eninge to move upward a couple inches and the header dropped right in. Did this on jack stands and did not have to lift so far that there was any risk of engine moving sideways as the bolt was still contained in the mount.

Good luck.
 
#28 ·
The shop got the install PDF and saw that the passenger side went in from the top so they were then able to take it out that way. They were doing the drivers side when I talked to them earlier today.

I think they should be finishing up and I should get her back tomorrow. I am hoping for the best!
 
#32 ·
In Memory of WaySouth Annie

Thank you for sharing your adventure taking WaySouth's ride to the other side of the Planet :thumbs

You bought one of the nicest, coolest and original R's around :right: I would have Love to purchase that ride!

We are going to miss it and Annie here in Florida:crying:

I'm attaching some Pics of your car, in the First Key's run, organised by Annie :wub: :wub:
 

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