Magnacharger Install Question

[chubz]

Hi Guys/Gals I installed a Magnacharger kit on a 2006 SSR 6.0

I did not Dyno the car before hand which brings me to my question. After the charger was installed and Dyno'd the vehicle made 407HP. So thats a whopping gain of 7hp.

The vehicle had a true dual exhaust system which I know can rob a supercharger of power so I installed a magnaflow system which bumped the truck up to 427HP and 405Tq

I have had several issues with the kit, torn belt and bad fuel unit.

But I was expecting something north of 480hp

Anyone have the same issue or have any experience with this issue. I am thinking of trying a different dyno as the one I used might not have been calibrated correctly.

Thanks in advance.

[hdflstf]

I assume you are talking chassis dyno not engine dyno. Right off the bat you'll lose in the neighborhood of 10% due to driveline losses so your 407 is closer to 450 at the engine.

Shredded belt may mean you need to verify all of the pulleys are aligned. I had to shim the idler on mine so the edge of the belt wouldn't contact the side.

[2005SSR6Speed]

The stock dyno at the wheels before the supercharger is typically around 300-320 depending on the dyno and auto or 6 speed.

The rating of 395 is the number at the crank not the wheels.

The MagnaCharger kit is designed for 5.5 psi of boost and you need to adjust for altitude.

You will loose about 1 psi of boost for every 2000 ft of elevation above sealevel.

[Mike in AZ]

If you ignore the absolute values of horsepower and torque for any particular dyno and go by percentage increase, you will be much better off.

If you use a standard of 5% gain per pound of boost, you will probably come out closer to what is real in any given situation.... as long as the "before" and "after" dyno is the same unit.

For example:
I'm running 7 pounds of boost and had a "before" measurement of 360 at the wheels. Using the calculation, it would be 360x1.35 = 486rwhp. The actual "after" measurement (on the same dyno, same temperature, same elevation) was 495rwhp.

Your case:
Using 5 pounds of boost and a "before" measurement (using Joe's numbers and some windage) of 320rwhp, you would calculate 320x1.25 = 400rwhp. Since we don't have a good "before" number, it looks like you are close at 407rwhp.

Please note that this is a general estimating number, not an exact science...... there are way, way too many varibles in the boosted engine calculation. What I can tell you, though, is that for every pound of boost that you increase in the intake plenum, you should get about 5% more power over the original number....... as long as you consider your baseline measurement.

The variability has everything to do with air density in the intake plenum and the ignition advance driven by the charge air temperature feed to the computer.

Regards,

Mike

[chubz]

I realize that listed and actual horsepower are two different things. I wasn't sure if anyone else had seen Dyno numbers for a stock 6ltr SSR. 320 is way to low for a car rated at 400 from the factory.

If you look at Magnachargers website they have a dyno test for a stock 5.3 and that shows a loss of only 32hp from rated HP. I would think that a 6L would we somewhere around 360 actual rwhp. That being said, this system should produce atleast 100hp (especially for the price). I should be at 460 to 480

Given the drive-train loss at 360 to my dyno run at 427 a 67hp gain is pathetic. I could have slapped on an ebay turbo system and gotten that result and paid 1 sixth the price.

I am at sea level so elevation and heat are not a factor. I am thinking this is either a ****ty unit or the fuel is ****ed and I am only getting a few PSI of boost due to the fuel.

[Mike in AZ]

Originally Posted by chubz

I realize that listed and actual horsepower are two different things. I wasn't sure if anyone else had seen Dyno numbers for a stock 6ltr SSR. 320 is way to low for a car rated at 400 from the factory.

If you look at Magnachargers website they have a dyno test for a stock 5.3 and that shows a loss of only 32hp from rated HP. I would think that a 6L would we somewhere around 360 actual rwhp. That being said, this system should produce atleast 100hp (especially for the price). I should be at 460 to 480

Given the drive-train loss at 360 to my dyno run at 427 a 67hp gain is pathetic. I could have slapped on an ebay turbo system and gotten that result and paid 1 sixth the price.

I am at sea level so elevation and heat are not a factor. I am thinking this is either a ****ty unit or the fuel is ****ed and I am only getting a few PSI of boost due to the fuel.

I think your numbers are within "reason" for a stock engine.... 390HP at the crank (stock SSR, standard day @ sea level) with about 13% system loss (typical?) yeilds 340 at the wheels. 340 x 1.25 (5psi @ 5% per pound of boost) yeilds a resultant of 425 at the wheels. 427 at the wheels seems about right for your boost level.

A few questions for you......:
1) What were the results of the baseline dyno run "before' the supercharger install?
2) What was the measured boost level during your dyno runs?
3) At what RPM did they lock up the torque converter during the dyno run?
4) Did the torque converter stay locked during the run?
5) What gear were they using during the dyno run?
6) Who did the computer tune?
7) Was the fuel delivery schedule map adjusted to maintain the right fuel ratios?
8) Is the fuel pump being boosted properly to give sufficient fuel to the injectors?
9) Did you replace the 45pph injectors with 60pph ones?

All of this is assuming that you were running premium fuel, the magnavolt fuel pump boost and that your tuner was actively engaged during the dyno runs.

I am also assuming that you are still running the 82mm throttle body and that you have the belt on the back of the blower setup to the right tension.

Regards,

Mike

[chubz]

Originally Posted by Mike in AZ

I think your numbers are within "reason" for a stock engine.... 390HP at the crank (stock SSR, standard day @ sea level) with about 13% system loss (typical?) yeilds 340 at the wheels. 340 x 1.25 (5psi @ 5% per pound of boost) yeilds a resultant of 425 at the wheels. 427 at the wheels seems about right for your boost level.

A few questions for you......:
1) What were the results of the baseline dyno run "before' the supercharger install?
2) What was the measured boost level during your dyno runs?
3) At what RPM did they lock up the torque converter during the dyno run?
4) Did the torque converter stay locked during the run?
5) What gear were they using during the dyno run?
6) Who did the computer tune?
7) Was the fuel delivery schedule map adjusted to maintain the right fuel ratios?
8) Is the fuel pump being boosted properly to give sufficient fuel to the injectors?
9) Did you replace the 45pph injectors with 60pph ones?

All of this is assuming that you were running premium fuel, the magnavolt fuel pump boost and that your tuner was actively engaged during the dyno runs.

I am also assuming that you are still running the 82mm throttle body and that you have the belt on the back of the blower setup to the right tension.

Regards,

Mike

This is on a 2006 SSR which received the modest 10HP bump to 400 versus the 05 which had the 390.

Everything from the tune to boost levels to fuel mapping was all done from the ECU tune from Magnacharger. The fuel booster was engaged and the pull was done in 4th which I know is pretty dumb since it was going 150mph on the dyno. I didn't drive it on the dyno btw.

[Mike in AZ]

Originally Posted by chubz

This is on a 2006 SSR which received the modest 10HP bump to 400 versus the 05 which had the 390.

Everything from the tune to boost levels to fuel mapping was all done from the ECU tune from Magnacharger. The fuel booster was engaged and the pull was done in 4th which I know is pretty dumb since it was going 150mph on the dyno. I didn't drive it on the dyno btw.

If your SSR is a six speed, then 4th is the right gear and 400hp is a good number.

If your SSR is an automatic, you need to use 3rd gear, not 4th for dyno runs. 4th gear is an overdrive in the automatic. All of the torque and HP numbers need to be recalibrated by the overdrive ratio. The HP rating for the automatics is 395......

Mike

[Doug Allen]

Dyno results vary dramatically form shop to shop, depending on the type of dyno utilized and the other criteria that Mike in AZ has previously posted.

My question to you is, how does it respond when you are cruising at around 3500 RPM, and jump on it? At that RPM, when you go to WOT, it should put you back in your seat, and possibly break the tires loose.

Send me a PM with your email address, and I'll send you baseline and after dynos on my '06 6 speed Hellvis, from when I installed the 112 Magnacharger, 410 gears, headers and a 90 mm throttle body, with true duals, in January of '07. From memory, the RWHP was in the area of 425-430. Could have been more, it was almost five years ago.

I have since gone to a 122HH Magnacharger, cam, Edelbrock heads, larger injectors, Lingenfelter fuel pump, etc.....

Last time it was dyno'ed in October of '08, it had 589 RWHP. It was in Phoenix, and the ambient temperature was near 100 degrees, I suspect it would gain substantially in January, when the temps are in the 40's.

The biggest gains you can expect, after your installation of a blower, is in the tune. If you have somebody like Joe Delano perform your tune, they will maximize the air/fuel ratios to meet your driving habits.

[xoxoxoBruce]

One question chubz, how does it feel driving it with the blower compared to before?

[chubz]

Originally Posted by Doug Allen

Dyno results vary dramatically form shop to shop, depending on the type of dyno utilized and the other criteria that Mike in AZ has previously posted.

My question to you is, how does it respond when you are cruising at around 3500 RPM, and jump on it? At that RPM, when you go to WOT, it should put you back in your seat, and possibly break the tires loose.

Send me a PM with your email address, and I'll send you baseline and after dynos on my '06 6 speed Hellvis, from when I installed the 112 Magnacharger, 410 gears, headers and a 90 mm throttle body, with true duals, in January of '07. From memory, the RWHP was in the area of 425-430. Could have been more, it was almost five years ago.

I have since gone to a 122HH Magnacharger, cam, Edelbrock heads, larger injectors, Lingenfelter fuel pump, etc.....

Last time it was dyno'ed in October of '08, it had 589 RWHP. It was in Phoenix, and the ambient temperature was near 100 degrees, I suspect it would gain substantially in January, when the temps are in the 40's.

The biggest gains you can expect, after your installation of a blower, is in the tune. If you have somebody like Joe Delano perform your tune, they will maximize the air/fuel ratios to meet your driving habits.

PM sent

[chubz]

Originally Posted by xoxoxoBruce

One question chubz, how does it feel driving it with the blower compared to before?

Well that's an easy question but a tough one to answer. It was almost two years ago that we installed a "True dual" system and that by itself killed all lower end torque. The truck was an absolute dog at that point.

After the Charger install almost all lower end power was restored yet it still wasn't a rock star. The exhaust was replaced with a high flow Y pipe. We got an increase of 20hp but no kick in the pants power I'd say.

It's hard for me to tell, we had at one point a 2008 Shelby Supersnake with 725hp, now that was a kick in the pants.

I'd say it feels much better than it did and has a lot more torque, I am thinking we were just expecting more power out of the system.

[xoxoxoBruce]

Thanks, I think you may need the right tune. I believe someone said the tune Magnacharger supplies is pretty conservative. Of course it's kicking two and a half tons in the pants, so you may need gears to get the launch you want.

[Paulee]

Hi Mike,
I'm seriously considering installing a Magnacharger kit on my otherwise stock 04 SSR. Main reason being that we spend 6 months of the year in the Prescott area and I would like to reclaim some of the power loss that I experience at this elevation. I have your radiator fan & tranny cooler & a K&N air fiter. Do you think it would be worth the expense and work to install a Magnacharger?
Thanks Mike,
Paulee

[Mike in AZ]

Originally Posted by Paulee

Hi Mike,
I'm seriously considering installing a Magnacharger kit on my otherwise stock 04 SSR. Main reason being that we spend 6 months of the year in the Prescott area and I would like to reclaim some of the power loss that I experience at this elevation. I have your radiator fan & tranny cooler & a K&N air fiter. Do you think it would be worth the expense and work to install a Magnacharger?
Thanks Mike,
Paulee

The short answer is ........ OMG - YES.

We can wake up that 5.3. and it's a WHOLE LOT of FUN.

If you are interested, I'd love host the installation in my garage and we can bring you into a new level of permagrin. Joe has seen fit to allow me to become a member of his dealer netrwork for Magnuson superchargers and I will be offering the same deals and support that you would get directly from him.

We can schedlule to do this in a weekend.

Mike

[Paulee]

Thanks Mike, sounds like the thing to do.
Will have to be after the first of the year cause I'll be gone most of Nov. & Dec. Will set up a schedule later.
Thanks again,
Paulee

[SSRNoir]

BTW I was privileged to drive Mike in AZ's newly blown SSR this last weekend and it now has me insanely envious of his setup. Now to save a couple of bucks for the next mod.....

[3yello]

I am also a new member, and I have been investigating both Edelbrock and Magnuson for installation on my '05 slingshot. Edelbrock says they don't make a kit for the car, and that their unit for the '05+ 'vettes will not fit the engine. Are 6.0 and 6.2 (LS2 vs LS3) external dimensions different? On a call to Magnuson a couple of days ago I was told that the tvs2300 was not available for the ssr, and the older unit would only put out about 100 hp. What am I to believe?

[RUN ROD RUN]

Originally Posted by 3yello

I am also a new member, and I have been investigating both Edelbrock and Magnuson for installation on my '05 slingshot. Edelbrock says they don't make a kit for the car, and that their unit for the '05+ 'vettes will not fit the engine. Are 6.0 and 6.2 (LS2 vs LS3) external dimensions different? On a call to Magnuson a couple of days ago I was told that the tvs2300 was not available for the ssr, and the older unit would only put out about 100 hp. What am I to believe?

It best to talk to Joe at LeftCoast32. He's our long time supercharger technical expert.
You can find his number listed in his web page.
LeftCoast 32
BTW - Welcome From So Calif.

[Mike in AZ]

Originally Posted by 3yello

I am also a new member, and I have been investigating both Edelbrock and Magnuson for installation on my '05 slingshot. Edelbrock says they don't make a kit for the car, and that their unit for the '05+ 'vettes will not fit the engine. Are 6.0 and 6.2 (LS2 vs LS3) external dimensions different? On a call to Magnuson a couple of days ago I was told that the tvs2300 was not available for the ssr, and the older unit would only put out about 100 hp. What am I to believe?

The SSR uses a truck style accessory section, not the one for the Corvette or the other "car" installations. The new Camaro is in that group. I've seen the TVS2300 on the new Camaro and it is at the forward edge of the intake plenum, not the rear like ours.

It's true that Magnuson does not offer the TVS2300 for the 6.0 SSR. That is a "Custom" kit from Joe Delano. Joe has installed several of the 2300s on SSRs, mine included. Joe's tune is what really makes this supercharger sing. The difference between the "run of the mill" Magnuson tune for the SSR (all models of supercharger) and Joe's is phenomenal. He optimizes the tune for all of the best fuel/air ratio attributes and is highly regarded by all who have gotten his work.

The rule of thumb on superchargers is that they should give you an increase of 4.5 - 5.5% power (HP or torque) for every pound of boost. My installation was right on target at 5.1%....

As for the Edelbrock system...... I'm not going to degrade them here..... it's been done in the printed press already. I'll just tell you that it is better to go with a Maggie.... and especially with Joe's tune.

If you want to see what one looks like and drive it...... just fly into Phoenix and I'll let you take mine for a spin.

Regards,

Mike

[SSRNoir]

I can attest to the new improved Mikey rocket....now I want one!

[2005SSR6Speed]

The TVS2300 Kits are a custom kit that myself and a few other members have worked on building into a really great kit that makes alot of power. The TVS2300 is built as a Hot Rod Kit and does not come with a CARB Certification. There are several members running this kit in different forms. Call anytime with questions.

Joe (760) 522-8669