Racing

Double Trouble · 05-01-2008, 09:43 AM

For you guys with engine/tranny mods what are you doing off the line to minimize wheel spin? Yesterday some guy pulled up next to me in a huge Dodge diesel truck that sounded like it had a lot of work done to it. It was loaded to the max with all kinds of custom work. He reved it up, looked at me and laughed. I couldn't resist! Light went green and I stomped on it. My tires broke loose for a second then it hooked. I left that Dodge like it was sitting still. I was way ahead of him and let off to let him pass. He came by me wide open but wasn't laughing anymore.

I have a cam,headers,Dyna-flow exhaust, Phoenix 2800 stall converter and dyno tune (407 RWHP). Since doing all the work it will boil the tires off the line. The traction control seems to make no difference. I used to complain about throttle hesitation and now I have the opposite problem. Once it hooks up it's gone but I want to launch it off the line with more traction. Any suggestions other than slicks?

Genaris · 05-01-2008, 05:42 PM

Do a burn out first?

hdflstf · 05-01-2008, 06:56 PM

Dump the GY RS-As

Topspin · 05-01-2008, 08:01 PM

I have similar things done to my 05 6 speed with similar issues. Something that came to mind as a possible solution is a device we use in supergas drag racing called a throttle stop. Some of the needed fuctions are in the SSR computer system. You would have to ask some sharp tuners if this could be done. Bryan Herter and Lyndon Webster come to mind. I think the ECM has the ability to set throttle angle and I know it can delay opening. So, if you open the throttle only part way for a second or so it would allow the tires to hook up some and could aid in absorbing the converter flash. Or maybe reduced throttle angle thru 1st gear, then full open. The other area would be the timing maps. Usually at the strip we pull timing out in high gear, but if you took 6 or 8 degrees away in first gear it would kill the torque some. Don't know if the computer can map for individual gears though. Anyway just some ideas I've been kicking around.

Double-L · 05-01-2008, 08:38 PM

Well a throttle stop is more for the dragster class, I have been racing for a long time, You can blow the tires off and still come off the line with a little work, If you come off easy like ease in it you will feel like the thing is wheel hoping and then you can get into it and cut some good lights, You can kill your timing right off the line till the tires hook, Spinning the tires some off the line is good because if you just hook a truck that weighs close to 5,000 pounds putting out say 500 or more hp something is going to break but when it comes down to it nothing replaces tires, Don't have to be full slicks just some good dot drag tires

Darc_vexiS · 05-01-2008, 08:49 PM

There is a difference with the TCM on and off with 2800-3000 stall...just roll down the window & listen.

The tires break loose real easy in the rain just a word of warning so ya don't spin out just be careful with your turns & acceleration.

Let's see...don't put so much tire shine on...

...Greg's vette servo rocks...

Hope you upgraded your 3rd gear clutch packs with that bigger stall...or upgraded that trans to handle more than what it's supposed to otherwise by your next oil change depending how you drive it...your tranny will go to hell.

Have fun...

Focks · 05-01-2008, 09:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Double Trouble

For you guys with engine/tranny mods what are you doing off the line to minimize wheel spin? Yesterday some guy pulled up next to me in a huge Dodge diesel truck that sounded like it had a lot of work done to it. It was loaded to the max with all kinds of custom work. He reved it up, looked at me and laughed. I couldn't resist! Light went green and I stomped on it. My tires broke loose for a second then it hooked. I left that Dodge like it was sitting still. I was way ahead of him and let off to let him pass. He came by me wide open but wasn't laughing anymore.

I have a cam,headers,Dyna-flow exhaust, Phoenix 2800 stall converter and dyno tune (407 RWHP). Since doing all the work it will boil the tires off the line. The traction control seems to make no difference. I used to complain about throttle hesitation and now I have the opposite problem. Once it hooks up it's gone but I want to launch it off the line with more traction. Any suggestions other than slicks?

My only suggestion is, next time, not to let the guy in the Dodge pass you

Nothing like getting peoples attention by allowing them to look at your tail lights

blznssr · 05-01-2008, 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Double Trouble

For you guys with engine/tranny mods what are you doing off the line to minimize wheel spin? Yesterday some guy pulled up next to me in a huge Dodge diesel truck that sounded like it had a lot of work done to it. It was loaded to the max with all kinds of custom work. He reved it up, looked at me and laughed. I couldn't resist! Light went green and I stomped on it. My tires broke loose for a second then it hooked. I left that Dodge like it was sitting still. I was way ahead of him and let off to let him pass. He came by me wide open but wasn't laughing anymore.

I have a cam,headers,Dyna-flow exhaust, Phoenix 2800 stall converter and dyno tune (407 RWHP). Since doing all the work it will boil the tires off the line. The traction control seems to make no difference. I used to complain about throttle hesitation and now I have the opposite problem. Once it hooks up it's gone but I want to launch it off the line with more traction. Any suggestions other than slicks?

I'm surprised that the traction control makes no difference. On mine, when the tires break loose with WOT then the TC shuts down the engine for a split second, the tires catch and then it goes on. This happens with WOT between 1st and 2nd and again between 2nd and third. So, after Joe D. explained this to me, I now just turn off the traction control if I don't want it to bog down when shifting.

MoodyBlue · 05-01-2008, 11:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blznssr

I'm surprised that the traction control makes no difference. On mine, when the tires break loose with WOT then the TC shuts down the engine for a split second, the tires catch and then it goes on. This happens with WOT between 1st and 2nd and again between 2nd and third. So, after Joe D. explained this to me, I now just turn off the traction control if I don't want it to bog down when shifting.

Right on Dude! And your torque sensors won't make the tranny loose hydraulic pressure. All your Torque is sent to the rear wheels. once the tires start spinning the rear end will hook up and $hit and Get. With T/C on your front Brakes are also applied. So if you are going to Race someone, Definately turn your T/C off.

AusTexKid · 05-02-2008, 12:04 AM

There are a number of things you can do to improve the suspension.

I have my '05 running some 1.78 60' times at the track WITH the RSA tires. The best improvement you can make is replacing the upper and lower 4-link bars in the rear suspension. The uppers are made of stamped steel and have a lot of flex. In fact, I bent the stock ones before I replaced them. BMR Fabrication makes some excellent bolt-in links that have greasable poly bushings in the ends. The stock rubber bushings are huge and mushy. They even offer a set of adjustable lower links. This allows you to correct the pinion angle if you lower the truck or move weight around. Next would be rear shocks. You want a shock that allows rapid extension but not rapid compression. This helps plant the tires on launch. There are none made for the SSR, but I adapted some Koni's from another application and made them work. Disconnecting the front sway bar also helps. Allows the front end to rise more rapidly.

As far as tuning goes, I have not found a way to directly control the throttle angle using the computer. I use timing to take some power away at launch and let it hook up. A mechanical throttle stop won't work on an an SSR because they are drive-by-wire. There is no external throttle linkage to put it on. I have experimented with using the traction control too, but it is too slow reacting and pulls too much timing at once. I currently have it disabled in the computer. It never comes on.

And last, there is now a 20" drag radial available. Nitto makes their NT555R in 2 20" sizes. BUT, they are a $600 pair of 10,000 mile (or less) tires. You would almost have to have another set of rear wheels with street tires on them for daily driving.

Double-L · 05-02-2008, 09:40 AM

You had a tune so if you can't tell any difference with it on or off the guy that tuned it turned it off in the computer most likely because you would be able to tell a difference, I have made a number of runs with my TC turned on and most was by mistake, All you do is look like a frog going down the strip if you have bad traction problems, Tires break lose, TC comes on tires stop spinning TC goes off tires start spinning again so on and so on, I have run a 12.59 with the TC on so it is not like you can't run with it on, In some cases it could save your truck if you spin alot in 2nd.

TMZSSR · 05-02-2008, 11:07 AM

I bought a pair of 17 inch aluminum wheels and BFG Drag Radials about a year ago, they hook up great but look kinda goofy because they are 275/40-17s that are only 25.5 inches tall, that was all that was available in a 17 inch drag radial a year ago. Now there are several sizes of 17 inch DR tires available one of them is 28.8 inches tall which is a lot closer to the stock height.

Topspin · 05-02-2008, 12:32 PM

Aus Tex Kid, I was not talking about a mechanical throttle delay. I was just suggesting the components might be there for a drive by wire part throttle with a delay to full opening. I thought someone put a Vette 90mm body on their SSR and didn't have full throttle opening. They were able to get it corrected through computer tuning, so I thought maybe a good tuner could put the delay package together. Next time I talk to Brian Herter @ PCM for Less I'll run it by him. Is your R a 6 sp.? If so was kind of RPM do you go through the traps at with what rear end gears?

AusTexKid · 05-02-2008, 06:49 PM

Topspin,

I would be very interested in what Brian has to say. I have not found any way to control the throttle action with the software I use (LS2 Edit). Perhaps some of the other tuning packages have that ability. I have been doing it by limiting the timing advance below 4000 rpm. I am an automatic with a 3600 converter. This gives the tires a chance to hook up and get the truck moving a little before the power comes on. It has worked well for me so far, but I'm always looking for other options.

At the track I cross the line about 5300 rpm in 3rd gear. Probably won't help you much to know that though. I have an automatic with 4.56 gears and a loose converter. A 6-speed will be completely different.