Yes! Testing confirms that Jim G's new dual cooling fans work!
It hit 95 degrees today by the time I left work a bit early this afternoon. On an extended commute home in that weather, the new dual fans described in my earlier posting:
I went through city traffic, suburban highway at rush hour, stop and go, etc, for about 1 3/4 hours total, and the gauge reading never got above the "2" digit in "210". The datalogger says it stayed at 190 to 201 or below, except for a brief excursion to 207 when I provoked it by idling in a parking lot for several minutes and then REPEATING the stop-and-go section of the trip, after the first pass through it only got the engine coolant to 201 maximum. (I figured let's push the testing a bit).
Furthermore, it's NOT the fans that allowed the excursion above 200 at all; it's the radiator's ability to transfer heat in a hot ambient environment. I KNOW this now because the coolant temperature gauge got to the 201 point NOT only while in stop and go, but also EARLIER in the trip when cruiusing at 60 mph BEFORE anyheat soak had had a chance to occur.
Those of you who have done the calculations as I have (mercifully few of you I hope ), know that even with a 2800 CFM throughput fan setup, once you get above 10 to 15 mph (depending on assumptions made), the air coming through just because of the forward motion does more than the fans can. In fact, the PCM shuts the fans off by about 30 to 35 mph as I recall. So, at highway speed, if the temperature can't be reduced, it's because the radiator can't transfer enough heat fast enough.
Anyway, I'm convinced now that after a year and a half of lookingn and experimentation, we appear to have a viable solution. I will talk to the shop about what it would take to engineer a do-it-yourself shippable kit, and what it might need to cost. But, as I pointed out in the earlier thread, a setup like this that has a 10,000 hour design life (200,000 to 500,000 miles depending on assumptions made) is basically a lifetime solution to replace once and for all that poor performing AND short-life stock fan.
My SSR: '03 Redline Red #1377, cooled by Simple Engineering
I have an '03 with the original fan in it, and although I know the odds are stacked against me, it hasn't failed yet. I know the day is coming, though, and I'm very reluctant to replace this fan with another OEM fan. I follow the credo "fix it once and fix it right." Thanks, Jim, for your research and work into these solutions, and sharing them with the rest of us. I'm very interested in your final product, and even if the cost of the alternative is higher than the retail price of the OEM fan, it's still cheaper than replacing an OEM fan on a biannual basis.
I just talked to the shop. The owner is away on a fishing trip to Canada now until Friday, so there won't be any kit infro available before the weekend or next week.
I'm sure following along here Jim and Mike, I specifically bought an SSR for the SOLE reason it's the ONLY cool hard top/ Convertable that allows cross country travel with all your supporting stuff. You can carry your clothes, telly, tent, and do some serious touring, imagine my disappointment !!!!!!!! My wife is disabled and deals with a lot of serious pain forever, I was totally disabled "before" I fractured my heel horse dancing at Mardi Gra, we were "planning" our perhaps "last blast" with a run for the W. Coast along you guessed it, the route that follows the Mexican Border..
So my super special sports car you can tour in, is essentially "junk" for all intents and purposes. My heart doctor just prescribed a move to SOUTH, S. Texas, which we love, another pop in the rear end for the "fun car". I am a disabled veteran of war and retired ass busting physically worn out career man on a 24/7 job.. As it sits I can't enjoy any of our planned activities, cause I just "can't" get stranded in the desert, what a deal.
Humans are like automobiles in one aspect, it's not so much the model year, it's the kind of mileage you put on 'er, lol.. Mine's been hard brothers.
So just keep up the good work, I can't do diddly till you get this cooling stuff to a point that a fella can head out with a level of confidence. Bad thing is you can only wait for the sucker to break if you're on warrantee.. Ideally, the replacement fan would be wired to run off the oem harness and the mounting adaptor set up to fit oem mounting holes, ahem... Not asking much eh, lol... There is a place in the back of mine where the original equipment would fit nicely with the luggage.. chicago
My SSR: '06 PB #21661 Born 8/29/05, GHL "Old School" True Duals, ADDCO bars, Eibach rear, Joe's Tune
You are right on....
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chicago
Ideally, the replacement fan would be wired to run off the oem harness and the mounting adaptor set up to fit oem mounting holes, ahem... Not asking much eh, lol... There is a place in the back of mine where the original equipment would fit nicely with the luggage.. chicago
Chicago,
My Aux Fan kit is designed to go into the truck without splicing any wires or drilling any holes and has several features that improve reliability and driver's confidence. The feedback from the Chevy dealers that have installed the Aux Fan for fanatics has been very complimentary. Jim's double fan replacement for the OEM unit is intended to be a drop-in replacement. We have some systems integration, control logic and connector configuration to work out, but I am encouraged by some of the stuff I've seen so far. As more trucks come off of the 3/36,000 warranty, I predict that this will become even more of a "hot issue"....
There WILL BE a good solution to all this crap in the coming months....... we just need a little time to get all the puppies in the box....
I absolutely love this forum, I was way to busy and gone earning my living to learn anything about cars, building, or repair, so in those endeavors I must either pay or rely on the kindness of strangers. It's most comforting to be able to make intelligent decisions regarding something you yourself have no knowledge about. Jim's wrote and advised me already, I'm following along as best I can. Obviously I can enterpret some of the tech talk, but I can understand results reports..
I'm looking into a preditor which can set the fan temp lower and all that, there is a dealer 90 mi from here, so I can get some help and hands on time. I'm not into radical, just seems like a good idea to set the fan lower, want to remove any restrictions, and go for improved mileage if it's possible. I got way better mileage with Texico Super, even though it's supposed to function well on 87. I let the car tell me what "it" likes, the improvement was monetarily to my advantage..
My priorities change frequently as I get time to read more.. This overheating deal is right up front now, but I'm exercising my patients. Tranny cooler seems to be in order even for just a high speed cruiser.. Having the pod intstalled tomorrow, their first installation, know more about the tranny then.. Wish me luck, these guys are very nice but don't exsude confidence.. I'll sit back and watch as you guys progress, I sure won't be making a trip without some sort of additional security so assume we'll do business soon.. I need to go to Tx way down there on business, hate to drive the Lincoln, last time they swoop and squated me, but I evaded them.. Towncars "can" stop, I was amazed... j.
For those nervous to drive.. ..Been driving my stock-fanned /spoilered '06 around Vegas for weeks now..been 100-109+ here a many times..I sit in traffic lots.. no cooling issues whatsoever in all situations..
My SSR: 06 Aqua Blur 6 speed 3SS with chrome package 23688 Born on March 1st 2006
Drive the truck!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by CashSax
For those nervous to drive.. ..Been driving my stock-fanned /spoilered '06 around Vegas for weeks now..been 100-109+ here a many times..I sit in traffic lots.. no cooling issues whatsoever in all situations..
I've got to believe like most of the "problem" posts on this great site that the overheating problem is exception not the rule. That's the reason for these type of forums. In my opinion there are vastly more SSR's that don't overheat than do. That said, sure there are over heating problems but Mike and Jim are working out various solutions to remedy the problem. In my opinion not using our SSR's in high temps is like not getting out of bed in the morning because something bad might happen. Just one opinion. Jim O
I drove home today in 97 degree weather. The commute today included city driving, slow and go expressway, highway, plenty of acceleration from highway stoplights to 60 mph, and stop and go.
The coolant temperature gauge repeated the same performance as on every other test day so far: never got above the bae of the "2" in "210".
I am now fearless about driving in hot weather, even with the supercharger kit.
My SSR: Black, '03, 1sb, #1256, License Plate was WOW FCTR
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimGnitecki
Well, here's more good news.
I drove home today in 97 degree weather. The commute today included city driving, slow and go expressway, highway, plenty of acceleration from highway stoplights to 60 mph, and stop and go.
The coolant temperature gauge repeated the same performance as on every other test day so far: never got above the bae of the "2" in "210".
I am now fearless about driving in hot weather, even with the supercharger kit.
Jim G
From reading lots of posts I seem to gather that the 03-04's temp will read at the base of the 2 in "210" even in stop and go traffic...unless their fan isn't working. Mine never goes above the 2. The 05-06's seem to read higher. A good test of this replacement fan would be in an 05-06.
I was also wondering what was the result of the Zirgo replacement fan
(16" Zirgo install kit HELP) and/or others that other people have tried.....
__________________
2003 Black SSR #1256 1sb
100000 miles (02/04/07).....
150000 miles 10/22/08
My SSR: '06 PB #21661 Born 8/29/05, GHL "Old School" True Duals, ADDCO bars, Eibach rear, Joe's Tune
Test Opportunity
Quote:
Originally Posted by WOW_FCTR
From reading lots of posts I seem to gather that the 03-04's temp will read at the base of the 2 in "210" even in stop and go traffic...unless their fan isn't working. Mine never goes above the 2. The 05-06's seem to read higher. A good test of this replacement fan would be in an 05-06.
The '03 thru '05 seem to regulate on the thermostat at 195, consistently. My '06 (and every other '06 I know of) regulates on the thermostat at exactly 210. GM says that all years have a 195 t-stat, but I somehow don't believe it. Looks like I need to get one of each (they are different P/N) and some coolant on the stove with a thermometer in the pan...... Anyone want to take this action item????
Wow Factor: Before I sueprcharged my 04 SSR, I ran it for well over a year.
I can tell you that when outside temperatures got high, AND you got stuck in stop and go (i.e. when sitting in traffic more than actuallymoving in traffic), there is no way that the engine coolant stays below 210.
After adding the supercharger, the issue of course gets worse.
A lot of those guys repoirting "no problems" live where the outdoor temperatures do not get that high, or they seldom get the COMBINATION of high outdoor temperature and stop and g traffic. That combination is a real problem for an SSR with a stock cooling fan.
Then, there's the issue of the fan failure rate on the stock fans. Check out the poll being done on this website right now, where owners are being asked to post whether or not they are still on the original factory fan (i.e. it has not yet failed). Note the high pervcentage of 03 and 04 owners who have had their fan replaced already. Note that even the 05 and 06 fans are failing already.
Finally, if you get a chance, compare a photo of the stock fan assembly to a photo of the dual Spal setup. It then becomes a no-brainer decision.
My SSR: Black, '03, 1sb, #1256, License Plate was WOW FCTR
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimGnitecki
Wow Factor: Before I sueprcharged my 04 SSR, I ran it for well over a year.
I can tell you that when outside temperatures got high, AND you got stuck in stop and go (i.e. when sitting in traffic more than actuallymoving in traffic), there is no way that the engine coolant stays below 210.
After adding the supercharger, the issue of course gets worse.
A lot of those guys repoirting "no problems" live where the outdoor temperatures do not get that high, or they seldom get the COMBINATION of high outdoor temperature and stop and g traffic. That combination is a real problem for an SSR with a stock cooling fan.
Then, there's the issue of the fan failure rate on the stock fans. Check out the poll being done on this website right now, where owners are being asked to post whether or not they are still on the original factory fan (i.e. it has not yet failed). Note the high pervcentage of 03 and 04 owners who have had their fan replaced already. Note that even the 05 and 06 fans are failing already.
Finally, if you get a chance, compare a photo of the stock fan assembly to a photo of the dual Spal setup. It then becomes a no-brainer decision.
Jim G
ok....
I know that fan failure is a problem (mine has failed). It was just looking like that the OEM fan was doing it's job until it failed. I'm sure that 2 years down the road I'll need another fan and I won't be buying an OEM one, but I was thinking that my SSR will be fine until the fan actually breaks again. And I'd like to be able to get a replacement for under $500 (that's why I was asking about the Zirgo fan again).
Keep up the good work.....
__________________
2003 Black SSR #1256 1sb
100000 miles (02/04/07).....
150000 miles 10/22/08
I just spoke with the onwer of the shop. He is going to work on a kit design, and asked me to clal him again mid next week. He is even thinking about an injection molded shroud and mount to customize and simplify the installation.
I left the office @ 3:30 PM yesterday - outside temp was about 108 degrees. In just under 3 miles the temp guage hit 260, the warning light and bell came on. I had cooling fan failure (again).
This was especially frustrating because I just picked up the car yesterday morning from the dealer for exactly the same thing. When I called the dealer, I also told them they may be working on the engine (again) as it had a faint tick which sounds like lifter noise.
I love the car, but DAMN.
I'm all for the new fan, Mike & Jim. I'll be the guinea pig. Mike, you and I have talked about product liability...I'll sign off when it's ready.
), know that even with a 2800 CFM throughput fan setup, once you get above 10 to 15 mph (depending on assumptions made), the air coming through just because of the forward motion does more than the fans can. In fact, the PCM shuts the fans off by about 30 to 35 mph as I recall. So, at highway speed, if the temperature can't be reduced, it's because the radiator can't transfer enough heat fast enough.
