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Discussion Starter #21
The BCM is between the seats behind the waterfall.

Dicktator
Well, of course it is. My bad. Mixing up my alphabet soup control module names and locations. :sneaky: So other than when it's really, really sunny and parked outside for a few hours it's not likely the BCM is getting very warm at all where we live.
 

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Discussion Starter #22 (Edited)
Update: I just finished installing a brand new GM 15242754 ignition switch. Now the stereo turns off every time I turn the ignition off. Tried it a half-dozen times with the exact same result.

So when I turn the ignition to "On/Run" (starting it sometimes, other times not) everything fires up normally including the stereo. When I turn the ignition off the stereo turns off immediately. Lance (@PokerGuy) wanted to know if the mirror light comes on at the same time the stereo goes off - it does not. The mirror light does come on as soon as I remove the key from the ignition though (as it did before). The instrument cluster lights do stay on until I open the door, then they go out (as they did before).

I also checked the wiring behind the driver side kick panel and it all looks to be normal with no pinched or loose wires.

The old switch came out smoothly and the connector unplugged without any struggle. It was one of the newer models with one grey side on the case. The teeth didn't appear to be very worn.

I'll wait for the experts to weigh in.

TIA! :)

SSR Removed  Ignition 091320 1.jpeg SSR Removed  Ignition 091320 2.jpeg
 

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Discussion Starter #23
@MrBozo, I just re-ran your suggested test. I put the key in the ignition, turned it to "On/Run" let everything get up to speed, then turned the ignition off and removed the key. Although the stereo still goes off immediately, both windows continue to work normally. Tried it several times with the same results.

So it appears that the RAP and probably the BCM is functioning normally?
 

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Spirited driver!
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Interesting. I would think that since you still have RAP, the stereo should stay on until the door was opened. The fact that ot behaves different than it did before (even though not correctly) makes me think that the issue was indeed the switch. Now, you just have to figure out why the radio shuts off even though you still have power to the windows.
 

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I agree with @PokerGuy .
As another test turn ignition key one step. This is accesory postion, you should see only battery and check engine light on. everything that works with key in this position should continue until door opens. If radio does not come on this would confirm problem is isolated to radio or wiring to radio.
Turn one more step and all other warning lights come on, some go out and blower motor will then operate. This is run position.
 

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Discussion Starter #27
I agree with @PokerGuy .
As another test turn ignition key one step. This is accesory postion, you should see only battery and check engine light on. everything that works with key in this position should continue until door opens. If radio does not come on this would confirm problem is isolated to radio or wiring to radio.
Turn one more step and all other warning lights come on, some go out and blower motor will then operate. This is run position.
Just ran that test. Turned key to accessory position. Only battery light is on, check engine light does not come on. Stereo comes on. Turning key one more step ("Run" position) illuminates all other warning lights, etc. as you outlined.
 

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Discussion Starter #28
Or maybe the ignition switch is off by a tooth?
I did note that although it starts up fine, I have to turn the key a little further forward than before, basically to where it stops before the starter engages.

I don't relish pulling everything apart again, but if it is a tooth off, that might explain that difference. Could that also explain why the stereo goes off immediately every time now? :unsure:
 

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Discussion Starter #29
Quick follow-up. I went ahead and pulled the new ignition switch out - without disconnecting it - and tried a few adjustments to the teeth, forward and backward. Found what feels like the "sweet spot" and it's back in but I left the shroud off just in case. With respect to the ignition all of the key positions work as I'd expect; off - accessory - run - start - off.

So it's still behaving the same way. Key in "Run" position and everything comes on including the stereo. Turn the key off, the stereo goes off immediately. Instrument cluster and aux gauge lighting remain on. Mirror light illuminates when the key is removed from the ignition. Windows still function normally. Open the door, instrument cluster and aux gauge lights go out, windows switches longer respond. Close the door and a few moments later the mirror light fades out. Repeated several times with the same results.

So what's confusing me now is that if it was the switch, why did the stereo work "normally" at least once each time I drove it? IOW the stereo would stay on after shutting off the engine and removing the key, until the door was opened as it was supposed to do?

Am I back to a failing/failed DLM? Would the window functions/RAP still work otherwise? Inquiring minds want to know. ;)

BTW, bonus - I'm an old hand at replacing the ignition switch now. :D

Thanks so much for all of your help with this, it's truly appreciated. (y)
 

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Spirited driver!
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It is an interesting mystery Rich. I wouldn't know how to make the radio switch off instantly without everything else if I wanted to. You have either made this the default situation or you have somehow entered into the part of the process after you have driven from point B to C. I would think it may have something to do with your radio wiring but if that is the case, why would it ever work differently? I'm stumped, but that is not too hard to do. Good luck my friend. Hopefully @Autoprof or others have alternative theories.
 

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Do you have a scanner that can read the diagnostic trouble codes (DTC) ? If there is a problem with the class 2 wiring, it might show up in a code.
 

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Discussion Starter #32
It is an interesting mystery Rich. I wouldn't know how to make the radio switch off instantly without everything else if I wanted to. You have either made this the default situation or you have somehow entered into the part of the process after you have driven from point B to C. I would think it may have something to do with your radio wiring but if that is the case, why would it ever work differently? I'm stumped, but that is not too hard to do. Good luck my friend. Hopefully @Autoprof or others have alternative theories.
Agreed. Also stumped as to why it worked "normally" and then even more stumped as to why it works only one way after installing a new switch! o_O

Thanks for all of the help Lance, much appreciated. (y)
 

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Discussion Starter #33
Do you have a scanner that can read the diagnostic trouble codes (DTC) ? If there is a problem with the class 2 wiring, it might show up in a code.
Great minds think alike! About an hour ago I connected my OBDII reader to see if there were any codes. Mostly I was concerned I might have triggered who knows what.

No codes, all clear, a clean bill of health. 🎉
 

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Discussion Starter #34
After piling through too many threads and posts to keep count, I came across several that talked about a bad cylinder being problematic. It doesn't seem likely, but I guess you never know.

I tried rocking the tabs where the ignition key is inserted back and forth. There's a bit of play, maybe 1/18" or so. Not enough to get the accessory/battery warning light to come on, but a bit sloppy. Then I noticed that with the key inserted, it's "spring loaded". IOW I can push the key in a bit and letting go, it pops back out, again maybe 1/8".

I've had vehicles where you had to push the key in before you could rotate it forward to start the car. Is that how our R is supposed to work? Because I can just insert the key and turn it to start it up, no pushing the key in at all. Just wondering if it's really sloppy and a new cylinder is in order. ❓
 

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I believe thread your talking anout ended up being the switch a tooth off. Because OEM and new radio both had same behavior i thinking new switch might be a tooth off, but i can't say for sure or give you ideas to test it until i look up wiring digram. I will not have time for that until tomorrow afternoon.
Maybe someone else could say for sure.
 

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Discussion Starter #36
I believe thread your talking anout ended up being the switch a tooth off. Because OEM and new radio both had same behavior i thinking new switch might be a tooth off, but i can't say for sure or give you ideas to test it until i look up wiring digram. I will not have time for that until tomorrow afternoon.
Maybe someone else could say for sure.
Thanks very much and no problem. I did try several different tooth positions. The one it's in now seems to correspond with everything working as it should. Well, except for the weird stereo on/off issue.

Is the key cylinder designed to be pressed in slightly to start it up? As mentioned, I just turn ours forward, no need to press it in or anything.

TIA Mark!
 

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Discussion Starter #38
I don't believe so, I will check mine tomorrow. Too late tonight.
Thanks Mark, agreed. Time for bed. Not to worry about the key/push question. Just a bit of trivia is all.

Please don't go to any additional trouble though. As mentioned, I can absolutely live with how it's all working now. I'm just one of those guys with a bit of OCD. I like things to work as they were designed. In this case, it's 99% there and I'm okay with that. ;)

Thanks again!
 

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So, while both the windows and the radio are part of the Retained Acc Power (RAP) the two items are fused separately. The fact that symptoms have changed after replacing the switch, adds the fact that wires have been pushed and pulled under the dash. Perhaps a pin is not seated fully in the connector?
Since the door has to be closed to make this system work it can be difficult to get under the dash, But the door can be open if you close the door latch with a screwdriver or your finger, to 'fake' the system to thinking the door is closed. Now you can get under the dash and investigate with the door open.
I'm still scratching my head about this mystery.
 

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Discussion Starter #40
So, while both the windows and the radio are part of the Retained Acc Power (RAP) the two items are fused separately. The fact that symptoms have changed after replacing the switch, adds the fact that wires have been pushed and pulled under the dash. Perhaps a pin is not seated fully in the connector?
Since the door has to be closed to make this system work it can be difficult to get under the dash, But the door can be open if you close the door latch with a screwdriver or your finger, to 'fake' the system to thinking the door is closed. Now you can get under the dash and investigate with the door open.
I'm still scratching my head about this mystery.
Good info. (y) I have a set of door props for car shows that allow me to have the door open, but lock it so I could use one of those too. Getting under the dash can be difficult under any circumstance for us old guys, but which connector(s) would I be investigating? Radio? Other?

Thanks (again)!
 
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