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Discussion Starter #1
Hi All,

The Local Chevy Dealer has said that my noisy shifts, and some time not very smooth shifts, is due to "skip shift". The trouble mostly happens at lower rpms, when I going easy. I checked the forums and it seems as though the SSR does not have the "feature" on the six speed manual transmission. I also checked the owners manual and there was no mention.

Can anyone authoritatively confirm or deny if the SSR has skip shift.

I had never heard of skip shift before today.
 

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I get skip shift in my 6 speed. Get on the freeway wind it up in third then put it in 6th and cruise along.
Does that count?
 

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HDFLSTF,

At least you did not go from 5th to 1st at 70 MPH trying to down shift to 3rd for a drag race or something. That "close ratio" transmission can be a bear on mis-shifts :lol :lol :lol

As far as skip shift on an automatic, this would be the first time that I have ever heard that lame excuse used by a dealer. These is no such feature as far as I know! I have an 04 automatic and it shifts just fine whether I am easily applying the throttle or standing on the thing. It sounds like a vacuum issue on the transmission. I have had that problem on my Ford Triton V10 with an automatic and it took them three tries to fix the thing but they finally did get it right.

My Best,

Rob
 

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The Corvette has a 'skip shift' on the six speeds.

There is a bypass to plug into the transmission wiring that gets rid of it.

If the SSR six speed does have a 'skip shift' also I bet the bypass will do the same for it.

Skip
 

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SA13355 said:
The Corvette has a 'skip shift' on the six speeds.

There is a bypass to plug into the transmission wiring that gets rid of it.

If the SSR six speed does have a 'skip shift' also I bet the bypass will do the same for it.

Skip
The SSR has a four speed automatic transmission. The six speed that we are discussing in these posts is the standard transmission. As far as a 'skip shift' or 'CAGS' on the automatics transmission goes the only reference I can find to this on the Forum is a reference from one member announcing the preditor tuner and one of the items mentioned is the fact that it turns off CAGS (aka 'skip shift'). I may stand corrected but would love for someone to confirm that our trucks do indeed have the CAGS feature enabled.

Regards,

Rob
 

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Skip shift, more correctly called "CAGS", applies ONLY to manual transmissions. There is no comparable feature on automatics (thank goodness).

Furthermore, although the Corvettes have CAGS, I have not researched to see if the 6-speed SSRs have it. They might or might not.

What CAGS does on a 6-speed is it places a mechanical barrier into the shift pattern, that forces your hand to move the shift lever NOT from 1st to 2nd, but rather from 1st to 4th gear, when you shift. This is to further improve (rather foolishly) the mpg achieved on the EPA-mandated mileage test for vehicle certification.

CAGS only works like this at LOW throttle settings. If you apply more than a specified amount of throttle, the PCM sends a signal that retracts the mechanical barrier and allows a 1st to 2nd shift.

IF the 6-speed SSRs have CAGS, it can be defeated one of two ways:

1. Installing an aftermarket part into the wiring harness that leads into the transmission. This aftermarket part generates a signal that keeps the mechanical barrier retracted. The part is inexpensive - about $25 or $30 as I recall from a few years back, but you have to know where to install it, and a lift sure makes it easier, so you'll probably pay your local hot rod shop (NOT your Chevy dealer!) to install it. It takes all of 5 minutes plus the lift up and lift down time.

2. CAGS is defeated even easier IF you have access to the PCM programming, as it is a simple enable/disable field in the PCM software. The catch here is that the CAN-based software in the 05 SSR has not yet been cracked and released to aftermarket suppliers, so right now you simply don't have this capability yet! But when the software IS released, this is the better way to go, as it is electronic rather than mechanical, and if done along with other useful programming changes ( :reddevil ), it costs nothing extra.

I've always wondered why GM saddled the manual transmissions, which already give better fuel mileage than the automatics, with this impractical feature. JUST TRY driving with CAGS enabled - it'll drive you crazy and break your high-rpm engine's back. In my opnion, it's abusive to the engine.

Jim G
 

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JimGnitecki said:
Skip shift, more correctly called "CAGS", applies ONLY to manual transmissions. There is no comparable feature on automatics (thank goodness).

Furthermore, although the Corvettes have CAGS, I have not researched to see if the 6-speed SSRs have it. They might or might not.

What CAGS does on a 6-speed is it places a mechanical barrier into the shift pattern, that forces your hand to move the shift lever NOT from 1st to 2nd, but rather from 1st to 4th gear, when you shift. This is to further improve (rather foolishly) the mpg achieved on the EPA-mandated mileage test for vehicle certification.

CAGS only works like this at LOW throttle settings. If you apply more than a specified amount of throttle, the PCM sends a signal that retracts the mechanical barrier and allows a 1st to 2nd shift.

IF the 6-speed SSRs have CAGS, it can be defeated one of two ways:

1. Installing an aftermarket part into the wiring harness that leads into the transmission. This aftermarket part generates a signal that keeps the mechanical barrier retracted. The part is inexpensive - about $25 or $30 as I recall from a few years back, but you have to know where to install it, and a lift sure makes it easier, so you'll probably pay your local hot rod shop (NOT your Chevy dealer!) to install it. It takes all of 5 minutes plus the lift up and lift down time.

2. CAGS is defeated even easier IF you have access to the PCM programming, as it is a simple enable/disable field in the PCM software. The catch here is that the CAN-based software in the 05 SSR has not yet been cracked and released to aftermarket suppliers, so right now you simply don't have this capability yet! But when the software IS released, this is the better way to go, as it is electronic rather than mechanical, and if done along with other useful programming changes ( :reddevil ), it costs nothing extra.

I've always wondered why GM saddled the manual transmissions, which already give better fuel mileage than the automatics, with this impractical feature. JUST TRY driving with CAGS enabled - it'll drive you crazy and break your high-rpm engine's back. In my opnion, it's abusive to the engine.

Jim G
Jim,

Thanks for the clarification. I hardley ever shift my 6 speed at low RPM's so I have not experienced this behaviour. I certainly hope that this feature does not exist in our transmissions. I cannot imagine GM installing "big brother" controls on a standard transmission, I would easily believe that BS on the automatic which is why I bought the stick. The confusing thing here is that there is no predator tuner for the 05 yet one of the features listed on the 03/04 list in a previous post was "CAGS" on/off. This is what lead me to think that this was an automatic feature since there was not a stick offered in those years. In any event I will get an answer today and post my findings. I will be with a close friend and SSR fanatic who happens to own a chain of chevrolet dealerships. Someone in his employ will be able to answer this question.

Thanks,

Rob
 

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Jim G. --- On the 6-speed you don't have to use the adaptor, just disconnect the switch. The only reason for the adaptor is to keep the end of the wires clean in case you want to install it back in later. ( Of course the vendors don't tell you this.) I use to tie - wrap the wiring up and that's the way it was when I sold the various Corvettes I had. You don't have to procure anything for a change!
 

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Rob: The only reason the advertising for some of the microtuners mentons CAGS is that the advertising feasture lists are not customized to manual or automatic transmissions, nor for that matter to specific models of vehicles in many cases!

This is why they can "truthfully" (but very deceptively) say "up to 25 more hp" and get away with it even when most of the models it will be used on will give far more modest gains.

The microcomputers all either:

1. have a question pop up early in the programming question series that asks if the vehicle is manual or automatic, or

2. If the microtuner is more sophisticated in its programming, might even theoretically determine the type of transmission just by reading the VIN.

There is NO CAGS for automatics! GM achieves the same (or more pronounced even) result by simply programming the PCM to shift the transmission at VERY low rpm settings whenever the throttle setting is low. It shifts the transmission at higher rpm when the amont of throttle applied is larger. There is actually a sophisticated algorithm used for this, that tuning software, and some microcomputers, allow you to customize infinitely. :)

Jim G
 

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p.s. Rob: If your 6-speed had CAGS, you would know it unless you NEVER ride in city traffic. It activates under most reasonable driving styles. :)

Jim G
 

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Computer Assisted Gear Selection (CAGS)

The SSR 6 speed definitely, positively does NOT have CAGS. Thank goodness.

The Corvette (also Camaro, Firebird and the new GTO) does. The specs are different on the GTO from the Camaro/Firebird and Corvette as far as what speed and what engine temperature activate it. The reason for the CAGS eliminator is to keep the wire connectors clean and also, to avoid a SES light. The way I took care of it in my GTO is with the Predator. Before I got the tuner, I had an eliminator plugged in. I still got the 1 -> 4 light in my instrument cluster even tho' the solenoid did not activate (since the electrical connection was not there). With the Predator, I don't even get the dash lights.

As raveschi said, I don't usually shift the GTO at low RPM, but when I do, I hate that feeling like something is broken. And if going from first to fourth at 18 MPH saves gas, I'll need a big explanation from someone to tell me how. Of course, 1st gear and 18 MPH at under 2000 RPM would make 4th gear what? 600? Doesn't sound too good for the motor to me.

Diggs
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Dealer Report

Thanks for all the info.

This is what the dealer gave me last night.

It is Document ID#848520

I am going to summarize the document.

Skipshift solenoid is a performance feature which forces the driver to shift from first to fourth gear during light acceleration. The Skip shift system consists of teh following components:

Powertrain control module (PCM)
The skip shift solenoid
The skip shift lamp

The PCM will engage the skip shift system when the following conditions are met:

The vehicle speed is between 15-19mph
The engine coolant temperature (ECT) is greater that 171 F
The BARO is greater that 76 kPa
The Accelerator pedal postion is less that 26 percent


Now for my editorial. I complained about noisy and rough shifts at lower RPMs between all gears. I never once mention getting locked out of second, which I never have been locked out of, and after reviewing the documentation, i either do NOT have skip shift or it is broken. Where is the the skip shift lamp?

I had never heard of "skip shift", and I wanted more info, they did not want to give me any info over the phone, but promised the document that I summarized above.

I feel like the dealer just wanted to push me off. To make matter much worse, they called and told me this at 3pm. they said they had to finish some other items up on my truck, and they would call when it was ready. they close at 7:30pm. At 7:20 pm I show up at the dealer, everyone except for one or two people were left. THEY NEVER CALLED ME. This is my first time at the service center. I thought that would have done a better job to make a better first impression. I am steaming mad about not getting a called.


Any advice would be helpful. I am trying to calm down to call them and straighten out the skip shift item.
 

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Diggs said:
Diggs,

Thanks for putting a pin point on that question. I was definately hoping that this was the answer. Although had it been installed on my 05 I would have pulled the plug TODAY :lol

Thanks Again,

Rob
 

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msears: This is how you miht consider handling the lousy customer service issue:

Visit the dealership in person and politely but firmly ask for a brief discussion with the service manager. If you have any grief or delay getting him, politely but firmly insist on speaking with the General Manager. When you meet with either one, your speech might go something like this:

Hi, my name is XXXXX. I bought my SSR brand new from you on xxxx . I have had a less than great service experience, and that concerns me, as you and I both know that I will get a followup satisfaction survey on that service experience within day or weeks, directly from GM. We also know that if I answer ANY question at ALL with any answer other than a perfect score, your dealership, your service advisor, and you will all be hurt by the way GM's system works.

I would REALLY like to give your service department all perfect scores, but I will not lie. So, we need to figure out how to fix the experience I ahve had so that I CAN honestly give you those perfect scores.

How do we do that, and how do we ensure that we never need to have this kind of conversation again, because it's not a pleasant experience for me OR you?

Jim G
 

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The skip shift is only on the cars for fuel economy and emissions requirements. The SSR is a truck and does not need that extra hardware.
 

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AHHH Now I know why...

freezer said:
The skip shift is only on the cars for fuel economy and emissions requirements. The SSR is a truck and does not need that extra hardware.
I had wondered why the SSRs were treated differently... thanks to freezer I know why now! :thumbs
 

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The 6 speed trans in the 05 SSr does have the skip shift. It only works when the engine temp is above 169 degrees, the vehicle speed is between 15 and 19 mph and the throttle position is less than 21% all this info is right out of G.M. service information. We have an 06 on the lot that I was going to by and it has skip shift.
 

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2006s are not for sale yet

wingrider said:
... We have an 06 on the lot that I was going to by and it has skip shift.
If you are referring to a 2006 SSR then I would have to say I have heard of no pilots or pre 2006s that have been made for release to the public for sale yet. It is my understanding that the LCC is down for Change Over and when they resume work then and only then will they start up with their regular production of 2006 MY SSRs.
 

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Confusing an 05 VIN with an 06 is a pretty serious error. A "several thousand dollars" error in fact, and pretty inexcusable, and illegal, at a dealership.

Jim G
 
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