Talked with my GM mechanic today who had just finished talking to a GM engineer on his HELP line...sooooo here goes The slight bog/hesitation on the automatics(with or without the T/C engaged) at WOT is WHAT THE CUSTOMER HAS TO LIVE WITH...chevy built it that way to slow US down and keep from beating OUR SSRs hmmmmmm...410 gear....is not acceptable to CHEVY...any change will void warranty....3.73 is WHAT THE CUSTOMER HAS TO LIVE WITH... guess I will have to accept a no problem SSR ( nothing broken,overheated,etc great SSR) Then again Ive read online about the hypertech and diablo programmers and will most asuredly use em when THEY finally come to pass. The gear will be changed to the 410 .... SO we shall see BEST to all
Update on my 05
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Have you changed the Air Filter?
I changed to the AIRHOG air filter and this seems to make the engine smoother and lose any slight bog/hesitation in my 04.
The part number is PPA 3914 and PEP BOYs have a $10 off coupon in their sales flyer, until Sept 30. Nornal price is $54.99 Cleaner kit is $11.99.
Did you make any air filter changes?
Carl
I changed to the AIRHOG air filter and this seems to make the engine smoother and lose any slight bog/hesitation in my 04.
The part number is PPA 3914 and PEP BOYs have a $10 off coupon in their sales flyer, until Sept 30. Nornal price is $54.99 Cleaner kit is $11.99.
Did you make any air filter changes?
Carl
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Common Sense Approach
Jetcop20,
It appears to me that there is some logic to the installation of the 410's. By installing the lower gears, you will actually be UNLOADING the drive line upstream (ie the transmission and engine) during heavy acceleration. This benefit is offset by the 10% increase in RPM's per mile that will reduce the life expectancy of the rotating components slightly. This sure seems like an excellent trade-off.
I would expect that the only warranty items that could be affected would be the parts downstream of the gear change - carrier, spider gears, posi parts, axles, wheel bearings, etc. These will see higher torque load due to the 10% increase in torque multiplication from the new gearset.
Go for it. :thumbs
Mike
Jetcop20,
It appears to me that there is some logic to the installation of the 410's. By installing the lower gears, you will actually be UNLOADING the drive line upstream (ie the transmission and engine) during heavy acceleration. This benefit is offset by the 10% increase in RPM's per mile that will reduce the life expectancy of the rotating components slightly. This sure seems like an excellent trade-off.
I would expect that the only warranty items that could be affected would be the parts downstream of the gear change - carrier, spider gears, posi parts, axles, wheel bearings, etc. These will see higher torque load due to the 10% increase in torque multiplication from the new gearset.
Go for it. :thumbs
Mike
I think a 4-11 is what my 05 auto needs also.
When I get a tuner (if it ever comes out), think I will
change my gears.
I carried mine to my dealer about the bog, they say
there is nothing wrong, I say BULL$HIT!
Got them to idle it up a little, think that helped some.
When I get a tuner (if it ever comes out), think I will
change my gears.
I carried mine to my dealer about the bog, they say
there is nothing wrong, I say BULL$HIT!
Got them to idle it up a little, think that helped some.
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I posted a thread on the airhog filter. Mine is a 2005 and the filter works great, I was not experiancing any bog or delay before the filter though. The AirHog filter is the same as a K&N or other reuseable filter.
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4,101 Posts
The actual cure for the bog is, I suspect, a high stall torque converter. One that stall at 2400 to 2600 rpm would be my guess.
The combination of only 3.73 gearing, heavy vehicle, big wide tires, and low stall (1600) torque converter is causing that bog.
A torque converter that stalls at a higher speed will give the engine a chance to bring some rpm, and therefore some power, to the table.
Jim G
The combination of only 3.73 gearing, heavy vehicle, big wide tires, and low stall (1600) torque converter is causing that bog.
A torque converter that stalls at a higher speed will give the engine a chance to bring some rpm, and therefore some power, to the table.
Jim G
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Does it still bog down with the traction control turned off? You might be able to program it out with a nice tune from Westers or another.
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Remember the 05 LS2 throttle is controlled by the computer not a cable.
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4,101 Posts
ALL SSRs have computerized throttle in place of cable.
Jim G
Jim G
Get a Yank
Yank makes one. 2600 stall I think. Around $600.00
I might try one of these somewhere down the road. I have always liked the way a higher stall feels in a vehicle. Not sure what the effect on performance would be.
http://www.converter.cc/inventory/SUVS/SUV.htm
Scott
Yank makes one. 2600 stall I think. Around $600.00
I might try one of these somewhere down the road. I have always liked the way a higher stall feels in a vehicle. Not sure what the effect on performance would be.
http://www.converter.cc/inventory/SUVS/SUV.htm
Scott
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Will the Allison converter fit?
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4,101 Posts
1hot12c: That URL you provided is a GREAT resource for anyone wanting to understand better how a torque converter affects performance. Be sure to read the FAQ, and also be sure to click on the button that is labeled "truck dyno results". Both provide superb information.
The "Stealth" model would appear to be a good idea for those with GM warranty concerns.
This is the best website I have been pointed to yet! Thanks again 1hot12c for sharing it with everyone!
Jim G
The "Stealth" model would appear to be a good idea for those with GM warranty concerns.
This is the best website I have been pointed to yet! Thanks again 1hot12c for sharing it with everyone!
Jim G
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4,101 Posts
Mikem: I doubt evry much that you could fit even the "weak" 5-speed Allison under an SSR floorpan. The diesel Allison transmissions are BIG.
I happen to know a lot about Allison transmissions because I used to be an RVer. I did tons of research on diesel engines and transmissions before selecting a specific motorcoach that used a Freightliner chassis, Caterpillar engine, and Allision 6-speed automatic transmission.
The Allison transmissions are very beefy and very sophsiticated, BUT the 5-speed version used by the pickup truck manufacturers in their diesel pickups is the "weak sister" in the Allision line. This is the tranny you got in a "cheap" diesel motorcoach, along with an inferior diesel engine. To get the "good stuff", you had to cough up an additional $20k to $25k. So, "proper" diesel drivelines are NOT inexpensive.
In addition, all diesels operate at VERY low rpm compared to gasoline engines. They typically peak at 2000 to 2200 rpm, and you've overrevved them by the time you hit 2600. If you put a diesel tranny behind a 6000 rpm gasoline engine, you will likely blow it up because it was not designed for high rpm use.
Jim G
I happen to know a lot about Allison transmissions because I used to be an RVer. I did tons of research on diesel engines and transmissions before selecting a specific motorcoach that used a Freightliner chassis, Caterpillar engine, and Allision 6-speed automatic transmission.
The Allison transmissions are very beefy and very sophsiticated, BUT the 5-speed version used by the pickup truck manufacturers in their diesel pickups is the "weak sister" in the Allision line. This is the tranny you got in a "cheap" diesel motorcoach, along with an inferior diesel engine. To get the "good stuff", you had to cough up an additional $20k to $25k. So, "proper" diesel drivelines are NOT inexpensive.
In addition, all diesels operate at VERY low rpm compared to gasoline engines. They typically peak at 2000 to 2200 rpm, and you've overrevved them by the time you hit 2600. If you put a diesel tranny behind a 6000 rpm gasoline engine, you will likely blow it up because it was not designed for high rpm use.
Jim G
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Thanks for the quick tranny input, Jim. It's worth getting some of those facts in the open. I was actually speaking about the converter only.
One of the chief engineers at work recently finished stuffing a warmed-up 8.2 liter into his 99 Suburban 4x4 tow vehicle. He pulls a 3 axle trailer with a 28 foot cigarette boat. He has re-engineered the systems to support the 8.2 and has an allison converter with a TH-400 derivative behind it. I thought the converter might fit in the bell housing we use. Guess not.
Regards,
Mike
One of the chief engineers at work recently finished stuffing a warmed-up 8.2 liter into his 99 Suburban 4x4 tow vehicle. He pulls a 3 axle trailer with a 28 foot cigarette boat. He has re-engineered the systems to support the 8.2 and has an allison converter with a TH-400 derivative behind it. I thought the converter might fit in the bell housing we use. Guess not.
Regards,
Mike
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4,101 Posts
Just so everyone understands that even GM recognoizes that a converter with a higher stall speed is sometimes needed with a heavy vehicle. here is a blurb from the Goodwrench wensite that sells transmissions:
12497318 4L60E Four-Speed Automatic Transmission
This new 4L60E four-speed automatic transmission assembly features electronic control of shift points, shift feel and torque converter clutch application. The two-piece transmission case allows use behind GM engines that have a Chevrolet V8 bellhousing bolt pattern and produce no more than 370 lb-ft of gross engine torque. This gearbox features a 3.06 first gear ratio for great acceleration and a 0.70 overdrive fourth gear ratio improved fuel economy. The high stall torque converter produces a stall speed of approximately 2300 RPM behind most small-block engines. The output shaft does not contain provisions for a mechanical speedometer application. The production use of this transmission assembly was for the police package 350 Vortec powered Chevrolet Tahoe. For proper transmission operation for both carbureted and fuel injected applications a control module and wiring harness is also available separately. 4L60E gear ratios: 1st 3.06, 2nd 1.75, 3rd 1.00, 4th 0.70. Use with transmission controller P/N 12497316.
Jim G
12497318 4L60E Four-Speed Automatic Transmission
This new 4L60E four-speed automatic transmission assembly features electronic control of shift points, shift feel and torque converter clutch application. The two-piece transmission case allows use behind GM engines that have a Chevrolet V8 bellhousing bolt pattern and produce no more than 370 lb-ft of gross engine torque. This gearbox features a 3.06 first gear ratio for great acceleration and a 0.70 overdrive fourth gear ratio improved fuel economy. The high stall torque converter produces a stall speed of approximately 2300 RPM behind most small-block engines. The output shaft does not contain provisions for a mechanical speedometer application. The production use of this transmission assembly was for the police package 350 Vortec powered Chevrolet Tahoe. For proper transmission operation for both carbureted and fuel injected applications a control module and wiring harness is also available separately. 4L60E gear ratios: 1st 3.06, 2nd 1.75, 3rd 1.00, 4th 0.70. Use with transmission controller P/N 12497316.
Jim G
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You could always use the Trailblazer Torque Converter, I know that the other gm trucks do it to get a higher stall and not effect warranty.
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